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What happens next

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Re: What happens next

Post by Oddwarf on Sun Jul 22, 2012 5:21 pm

Let's get scratchy!

Got it? Start from scratch... Scratchy? ... No? Darn.

Anyway. Massive city: Yes please!
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Re: What happens next

Post by Andy7320 on Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:39 am

Start from scratch- Minecraft is a game of creation and ideas why would you rebuild existing structures, yeah, your old ones may have been great but its a metaphorical kick in the face to your imagination and ideas for the future.
Plus it does put a burden on the select few with creative mode and creative always, no matter how well implemented leaves itself open for exploitation, i.e people hoard or store things in secret, i mean, how well do you know these people, really? Don't take me for someone who doesn't trust, just i always remain sceptical.


Last edited by Andy7320 on Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:55 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Stops me looking like such a cynical prick.)
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Re: What happens next

Post by Tengard on Mon Jul 23, 2012 6:09 am

I'm sorry you are skeptical about the hidden motives of the protectors of our server's integrity. XD if you were to trust anyone, the people that were proposed to have creative would be the ones. ;) Besides that, I'm pretty sure there'd be to much work to make secret hidey holes. Thank you for worrying about an important factor though. :)

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Re: What happens next

Post by Mazer_ on Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:57 am

Hmm, I'd like a rebuild from scratch.

Although what's this about a mega-city, personally, I don't think that would work out too one, I like how each town has it's own theme and individuality.
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Re: What happens next

Post by Khaddo on Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:17 pm

I have to say that I think starting from scratch would be a better option. Despite the amount of work put into the two cities, it's really nothing that we couldn't do bigger and better. Each attempt teaches you little things that could benefit the town even more, even if in just small ways.

Considering that Horizon sort of died away slowly, the idea of one mega-city seems pretty sound. I understand people like having multiple cities, but honestly we haven't been able to keep more than two at a time (and Cerberus pretty much sucked the life out of those towns in the end anyway).
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Re: What happens next

Post by Andy7320 on Mon Jul 23, 2012 7:47 pm

A mega city seems ok, but will individual players freedom be compromised? I quite like to do my own thing!
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Re: What happens next

Post by Sealand on Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:35 pm

Mazer_ wrote:I don't think that would work out too one, I like how each town has it's own theme and individuality.
Individuality =/= One town being better than all the rest

To be honest, the only towns that ever had major individuality was Uron'gar, Risen, and MAYBE Sanctuary. Every other town was pretty simple, give or take Cerberus' grand buildings.

Andy7320 wrote:A mega city seems ok, but will individual players freedom be compromised? I quite like to do my own thing!
Although I wouldn't advise it, players may still walk out into the wilderness and dance around fires naked do whatever they want within the guidelines of the rules, of course. You'd also have to be a reasonable distance from the city, like normal.

However, don't expect roleplay to come to you, and I'm not sure why you wouldn't want to roleplay on a roleplay server.

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Re: What happens next

Post by n008i3 on Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:58 am

I vote for option A. The creative mode option seems like a lot of work and I just don't trust anyone to rebuild SFe. I know that it was not that big or grand but I spent a lot of time on it. That guild was my project on the server. I did not really have anything else to my name. Starting over would hurt :(.... but I think that it is the better alternative. I also I vote for the one large city. I think that a large city would help to centralize the RP, but I think that it would also be easier to organize. I like Scopes idea of districts, but have a few ideas of my own. We should organize the city by the size of the houses, we should have a market area, a research area, and a place for guilds to build as well.

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Re: What happens next

Post by Skull Sphinx on Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:35 am

Maybe we can make a 4-part town with a main castle in the center of the town. We can have a poor district, mostly wooden houses and tents and dirt ground, market area, with all the shops cobble stone and wood, etc., upper level with the wealthy and royal live, metal blocks, stone etc., and a guild section with the guild buildings and "special" services like quests, etc. That sounds legit!!! And who ever is taking over the server can have or appoint the "Royal Family". Whatcha think?
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Re: What happens next

Post by zpallin on Tue Jul 24, 2012 7:46 am

I'm down for starting over. I mean, it sucks, but I think we have a couple important things to implement in order to make a perfect map. I have a couple of ideas that I am going to highlight in a separate thread.

Sorry Wheeind, yet again.

Skull Sphinx wrote:Maybe we can make a 4-part town with a main castle in the center of the town. We can have a poor district, mostly wooden houses and tents and dirt ground, market area, with all the shops cobble stone and wood, etc., upper level with the wealthy and royal live, metal blocks, stone etc., and a guild section with the guild buildings and "special" services like quests, etc. That sounds legit!!! And who ever is taking over the server can have or appoint the "Royal Family". Whatcha think?

I agree it would be awesome, but history shows that centralized townships never survive for long. I really believe that the spawn point should be a shrine, something small and simple, and nothing can be built very close to it as to assure newcomers have to adventure a little bit out to find a city.


Last edited by zpallin on Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:21 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: What happens next

Post by Faelar Laelither on Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:13 am

who ever is taking over the server can have or appoint the "Royal Family". Whatcha think?

The people of the Dawnlands have never really been accustomed to a monarchy. The majority of towns have been run by mayors and councils.
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Re: What happens next

Post by Skull Sphinx on Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:27 am

Ok, well maybe the castle can be there from an old monarchy, so now the town mayor and council lives there and works out of it. It was a simplistic idea and meant to be changed and refined.
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Re: What happens next

Post by spiffzombie on Tue Jul 24, 2012 9:11 am

I vote start from scratch. this way you can prevent people from cheating with creative mode. Also, creative mode makes things boring if you going to use the map of survival mode.

I dislike the idea of the mega city. yea it allows a nice place for RP, but it takes the fun of competition of cities out of the server. Maybe uses creative mode to make a rail system between well of cities so that RP can spread?

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Re: What happens next

Post by Squii on Tue Jul 24, 2012 5:10 pm

spiffzombie wrote:I vote start from scratch. this way you can prevent people from cheating with creative mode. Also, creative mode makes things boring if you going to use the map of survival mode.

I dislike the idea of the mega city. yea it allows a nice place for RP, but it takes the fun of competition of cities out of the server. Maybe uses creative mode to make a rail system between well of cities so that RP can spread?
There will be no "cheating with creative mode" since only mods/admins that are willing to will help rebuild with creative.
Second, I'm not sure getting steam-rolled by Cerberus is a "competition".
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Re: What happens next

Post by chipset3363 on Tue Jul 24, 2012 5:32 pm

Ive lost so much (my exp farm, my chest of diamonds, all my enchanted picks).
Using creative would give only some people (the people in citys [prob]) the most benfit out of that option, even tho we would have the citys back in relativily OK conditon the people wouldnt have the reasouces or be at the stage at which they where to carry on with development. Starting a 'fresh' would give everyone a chance to restart from square one and it would leave room for improvement on what we have learned from the last map. (also i think there should be a copy of the world before anything is built and 2 copys of the latest version of the world so this dosent happen again)
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Re: What happens next

Post by Sealand on Tue Jul 24, 2012 5:37 pm

chipset3363 wrote:(also i think there should be a copy of the world before anything is built and 2 copys of the latest version of the world so this dosent happen again)

Please don't tell us how to do our jobs. We realize this. It will be fixed. The only reason didn't get a copy of the old map is because Scope was away and Frazz only came once in a blue moon.

spiffzombie wrote:Maybe uses creative mode to make a rail system between well of cities so that RP can spread?
A railway was already built by Dark, and no offense to him, neither cities really wanted it. At least an above ground one because they're a bit unsightly.

Hell, neither towns even built a pathway to each within the couple months or so they've been up.

Not to mention, Admins don't use creative mode to do that kind of stuff.

spiffzombie wrote: this way you can prevent people from cheating with creative mode.

Maybe uses creative mode to make a rail system between well of cities so that RP can spread?
Also, really? We shouldn't use creative mode in case the admins/moderators CHEAT, but we should maybe use it to make a rail way.

I think you guys are getting the wrong idea on who is using the creative mode. It will ONLY be moderators and admins.

No regulars, normal players, donators, or so on. If you don't trust the people whose job it is to protect the server, somethings going on and we should know about it rather than letting it fester.

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Re: What happens next

Post by AJ.Wisteria on Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:50 pm

Sealand wrote:A railway was already built by Dark, and no offense to him, neither cities really wanted it. At least an above ground one because they're a bit unsightly.

Hell, neither towns even built a pathway to each within the couple months or so they've been up.

Maybe instead of a railway or a massive underground/overground system we build little paths? Like what Frazz built for his snow mansion? Something surrounded by fenceposts that can easily blend into the surrounding area. I dunno, just a thought. It'd be nice to have an actual path to follow! xP

Squii wrote:Second, I'm not sure getting steam-rolled by Cerberus is a "competition".

Horizon was trampled by a herd of elephants Squii, what is this "steam roller" you speak of? xD
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Re: What happens next

Post by Sealand on Tue Jul 24, 2012 8:57 pm

AJ.Wisteria wrote:
Maybe instead of a railway or a massive underground/overground system we build little paths?

Yeah. That's what I meant. Neither cities really went through with the path after Blaze marked it out. Even though most of it was by sea, so there was little to do.

Mostly people set their /home in New Cerberus and just /spawn'd back to Horizon.

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Re: What happens next

Post by Faelar Laelither on Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:10 am

I am contemplating the possibility of starting a new starter kit thread. Any disagreements? I'd be in charge of it this time.
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Re: What happens next

Post by AJ.Wisteria on Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:38 am

Sealand wrote:
Yeah. That's what I meant. Neither cities really went through with the path after Blaze marked it out. Even though most of it was by sea, so there was little to do.

There was a path by sea? I never found that one :/ Plus it'd be nice to actually put in a road, mostly because Horizon won't be "Spawn Town" anymore (at least, that's what everyone keeps saying).

Also, I like the idea of a new starter kit thread. I never got mine, but that's ok. It'd be helpful for getting us started on a new map (general tools, etc.).
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Re: What happens next

Post by Faelar Laelither on Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:45 am

never got mine, but that's ok.

Oh, don't worry. I'll make sure everyone who applies gets one, if everyone agrees to the idea.
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Re: What happens next

Post by nighttiger1000 on Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:18 am

I definitely agree to the starter kit idea, it will help a lot of people with the development process.
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Re: What happens next

Post by Sealand on Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:41 am

AJ.Wisteria wrote:There was a path by sea? I never found that one :/ Plus it'd be nice to actually put in a road, mostly because Horizon won't be "Spawn Town" anymore (at least, that's what everyone keeps saying).

There's wasn't a path built. Blaze marked it with torches, and told everyone. It was near... what was the housing district called? Little Nook? Blaze even had people test it for him.

Yet nothing was done with it.

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Re: What happens next

Post by BlazeZeroThree on Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:07 am

I'm really not sure how much of a radical departure a single-city system is from our multi-city system as people realize. While I'm not completely against it, I'd like to point out several crucial features that made NC what it was as a successful and prosperous town, and why it might possibly be, well, a bad idea for us to re-implement the previous, albeit successful, system in a single-city system:

1. Cooperative construction. I was very much comfortable working with Wind to construct NC, because I was largely given the freedom to build my own visions of the buildings of NC, along with the road layouts, general infrastructure, and area planning. Wind helped to guide along some components of the planning, such as the vague district areas (separating government districts from the residential district from the research district, and so on), and was instrumental in clearing out/flattening land so that construction could take place in the first... place. Perhaps most importantly, Wind provided the abundant resources necessary for me to expedite construction as fast as I could imagine up building plans, greatly accelerating the pace at which NC was built.

2. Tight aesthetic and citizen control. In all of NC with its structures and streets, only about 3 or 4 were not built directly by the city itself. There's very much a reason we were very conservative with our building permits. We wanted to make sure the entirety of NC was RP-compatible, so that every building could have some sort of purpose, and that absolutely nothing in the city was clearly OOC or simply ugly. Our plans for construction were almost always based upon RP purposes, and because of this, the entirety of the city was able to find a use.

3. Streamlined politics. The NC election was clean, and it was fast as hell. No offense intended, but Horizon's election was a mess, and it took a terribly long time to figure out Peace would be the mayor of the city, which means it took that much longer to get the city up and running. Beyond that, there was very little in the way of strife in between Wind and me, and if anything, we worked pretty well together in building up the city faster than either of us could do alone. We had very little in the way of an actual bureaucracy, and for the most part, we operated independently from each other.

The issue with the megacity is that unless it's a clean, simple council of two or fewer people, then a great deal of these points collapses, especially when put under a more diverse population (ie. people who RP and people who don't but still have interests). On top of that, the immense degree of control that NC had that I believe was crucial for its success can't be imposed on a single megacity, at least plausibly without significant dissent. I'm very much used to a clean, red-tape-free system, which a council could easily fudge up. (also note that if the single-city system is implemented with an excessively large council, I will politically resign from said city) The benefit of our previous two-city system was that if one wanted more freedom over construction, you could move and build over at Horizon, and if you wanted a clean, organized city, you could move over to NC and apply for a permit if you were so inclined.

I truly don't mean to sound elitist with the issue, but I don't believe most people here understand the processes that were necessary in building up an organized and proper city fit for RP. I strongly believe these issues need to be taken under consideration, even if you're not someone instrumental in managing the city itself or part of its construction.

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Re: What happens next

Post by Sealand on Wed Jul 25, 2012 2:26 am

And with that, another poll has started. Frickin' 16 to 3. The Mega city plan vs our old system of having multiple cities.

Just an FYI, for the multiple town system starting up. The first two cities will be 'on the house' so to speak. Meaning the first two towns with 5 or more ACTIVE people in them will immediately be considered towns so long as they build the required buildings in the near future.

Basically meaning NewNew Cerberus and whoever else gets 5 active members first, be it the Horizon crew or someone else.

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